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Thread: Sxr Ultra! 1200

  1. #21

    Re: Sxr Ultra! 1200

    Quote Originally Posted by jrddillon View Post
    Only in Wi. do we put fat in fat to eat! Is this build done?
    Gadammiit whats the rush!

    Nah mostly done, motor is built. Honestly need to start bolting stuff in but i havent gotten around to it lol
    1994 1100 SJ - Dead
    1996 spec hx
    "I'm going to be installing the hooker on my driveshaft in the next two weeks." -Element3488

  2. #22
    1994 1100 SJ - Dead
    1996 spec hx
    "I'm going to be installing the hooker on my driveshaft in the next two weeks." -Element3488

  3. #23
    1994 1100 SJ - Dead
    1996 spec hx
    "I'm going to be installing the hooker on my driveshaft in the next two weeks." -Element3488

  4. #24
    PWCToday.com Is My Home Away From Home wmazz's Avatar
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    Re: Sxr Ultra! 1200

    Normal watercraft pipes do not work well on 3 into 1 exhaust manifolds.
    You would be better off building a pipe like what they use on an ultra-
    light airplane (same as JS550,SX/SXI750, & SXR 800). They are 1/2 the
    tuned length of a regular pipe. A box with 10 times the displacement really
    works well, but isn't necessary. Use shallow angles 2' to 4' is all that is
    needed.

    I have also dyno tested triple straight pipe. Not great for peak hp, but it
    will have torque like an outboard motor.

    Either option will work well with a large diameter, free flowing waterbox.



    Bill M.
    Last edited by wmazz; 12-03-2018 at 12:10 AM.
    Horsepower == Speed, RPM != Speed



  5. #25

    Re: Sxr Ultra! 1200

    Quote Originally Posted by wmazz View Post
    Normal watercraft pipes do not work well on 3 into 1 exhaust manifolds.
    You would be better off building a pipe like what they use on an ultra-
    light airplane (same as JS550,SX/SXI750, & SXR 800). They are 1/2 the
    tuned length of a regular pipe. A box with 10 times the displacement really
    works well, but isn't necessary. Use shallow angles 2' to 4' is all that is
    needed.

    I have also dyno tested triple straight pipe. Not great for peak hp, but it
    will have torque like an outboard motor.

    Either option will work well with a large diameter, free flowing waterbox.



    Bill M.
    what about this manifold where they all feed into 1 exit, what kind of straight pipe would you recommend? just a straight 3 inch diameter tube?

    I am working with what i have in the shop, my measurements show this is nearly identical in length to a stxr1200 pipe, but the factory pipe has no chance of fitting in there. The sxr 1200 on x-h2o used a highly cut and welded factory style pipe, which is an option in the future.

    10x the displace of a cylinder or of the motor? i'll have to look into it unless you have some resources to paste a link to.
    1994 1100 SJ - Dead
    1996 spec hx
    "I'm going to be installing the hooker on my driveshaft in the next two weeks." -Element3488

  6. #26
    PWCToday.com Is My Home Away From Home wmazz's Avatar
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    Re: Sxr Ultra! 1200

    What kind of fabrication can you do at your shop?

    What kind of welders do you have access to? Do you have a
    wood cutting band saw and a disk or belt sander?

    If you purchased some rolled cones could you cut them, weld them, and fab a water
    box? Or can you cut and weld straight and "U-bends" to a given shape?

    I have spent a considerable amount of time dyno testing Kaw, Yama, tigershark
    triples. But not the later Kawi or Yama triples. That experience taught me that
    a return wave from a rear cone has very little effect. Only the front cone matters.


    Bill M.

    10 x 1 cylinder would be adequate, the log manifold is a good starting point. No matter
    what you do, it would help to get a rough tuned length calculated.

    Depending on what you can build, may determine what I may be able to help you with,
    a straight pipe, a megaphone, an ultralight pipe that ends inside the water box.

    The exhaust port duration would help, the exit diameter of the stock log exhaust
    manifold, and the length from the ex man outlet to the center cylinder.

    What is the normal peak rpm?
    Last edited by wmazz; 12-04-2018 at 10:50 PM.
    Horsepower == Speed, RPM != Speed



  7. #27

    Re: Sxr Ultra! 1200

    I will have to get back to you on dimensions and port durations.

    Ac/dc tig, mig, plasma cutter, sanders, nearly every hand tool available to man. I have spare cylinders i can bring home and map tonight.
    1994 1100 SJ - Dead
    1996 spec hx
    "I'm going to be installing the hooker on my driveshaft in the next two weeks." -Element3488

  8. #28

    Re: Sxr Ultra! 1200

    Ultra 150 port mapping and timing for future googley searches:
    I have some rough numbers, about as close as i can measure with digital calipers and paper mapping:

    #1 cyl to manifold exit :101 mm
    #2: 236 mm
    #3: 376 mm
    exhaust exit: 60 mm

    Stroke : 78mm
    top of bore to exhaust: 38.4 mm
    top of bore to bottom exhaust: 79.7 mm
    top of bore to transfers and boost: 61.9 - 62.0 mm

    Top of exhaust port to end of cylinder casting: 64.8 mm
    Bottom of exhaust port to end of cylinder casting: 58.3 mm
    The exit is sloped, as the casting to where it meets the manifold is sloped.

    Rpm: assuming around 6900 rpm +/- 100?

    http://lambretta-images.com/archive/porttimingprint.php



    stroke 78
    conrod length 140
    piston crown to top of barrel 2.83
    height of exh port, top of exh port to top of barrel 41.3, 38.4
    height of transfer port, top of transfer to top of barrel 18.2, 61.9
    exh duration 197.5
    transfer duration 265.9
    blowdown 34.2
    1994 1100 SJ - Dead
    1996 spec hx
    "I'm going to be installing the hooker on my driveshaft in the next two weeks." -Element3488

  9. #29
    PWCToday.com Is My Home Away From Home wmazz's Avatar
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    Re: Sxr Ultra! 1200

    Someone should make a sticky of that link!

    Based on your info, I determined a tuned length of 430mm to 392mm
    from the flange of the exhaust manifold. That covers the possibility
    of peak HP near 6500 to 6900rpm.

    Keep in mind, the goal here is to scavenge fuel not use a plugging
    wave to stuff fuel back into the cylinder. Theoretically the plugging
    action is facilitated by pressure changes inside the exhaust manifold.
    An SAE paper by one of Blair's associate Professors or Doctoral student
    was released shortly before Kawasaki and Yamaha built there 3 cylinder
    engines.

    The simplest plan is a section of straight tubing with a 60mm id, 430
    to 392mm long ending inside a water box. The point where the tubing
    ends in to a large open space is the end of the tuned length. I suggest
    that you use a larger diameter tube as the exit, possibly ~3.0"

    If you use a silicone hose to couple to the water box, you will need some
    form of water cooling. Perhaps a larger diameter can be welded to the
    60mm id tube and it will be water injected before the hose.

    Keep in mind what will happen to the water inside the pipe or waterbox
    if the ski rolls upside-down. Try to build in features to prevent water
    ingestion or a hydro-loc.

    The next possibility is a megaphone using a 2' to 4' (max) diffuser, and
    a 45' baffle cone with a 50mm exit. The exit is the end of the tuned
    length, and I recommend that no tubing be welded to the 50mm id.
    Instead weld a larger diameter tubing as a coupler to the waterbox and
    be sure to add water after the megaphone, and before the rubber coupler
    between the pipe and waterbox.


    The last possibility is a 550, 750, 800 style exhaust system. The tuned
    length terminates at the end of the diffuser where it opens to a large
    area. Use these stock exhaust systems as a guide. My recommendation
    is to use a 2' to 4' front cone, and I don't recommend any angle greater
    than 4'.

    If you need to, you could add 2" in length. It will lower the estimated
    peak to 6000, but it may help you to adapt your pipe to a preexisting
    pipe.

    Keep in mind that nothing here is exact, because of the log manifold.
    One cylinder may start to produce power early and the other late. But
    it will be similar to the stock exhaust system.

    If you end up building one of these suggestions, I recommend a smaller
    impeller than stock to begin with.



    Bill M.

    Something else, the exposed exhaust tubing can heat up the air inside
    the engine compartment. Header wrap or water jacketing could help
    prevent some HP losses due to the increased air temp. BM.
    Horsepower == Speed, RPM != Speed



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