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  1. #1
    PWCToday.com Is My Home Away From Home Spim's Avatar
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    WTF Wisconson , Protesting, this ain't Egypt !

    Sorry, I guess you can see my opinion on the Wisconsin Protesters being little girls about being asked to pay their fair share towards pension and benefits...



    Would you picket your employer if he only offered to pay 88% of your benefits ?
    me...
    wow.. hell no i'd take him to lunch ! Thats spectacular news !

    Would you picket if he only offered to pay 1/2 your pension ?
    me...
    wow.. hell now, now he gets beers because yesterday I had NO Pension ! Thanks boss !

    Would you picket for anything when its fkn 5 degrees outside ?
    me...
    prohibition perhaps.. but NOTHING ELSE !

    no i didn't research all the details, and frankly spare me the poor me speeches, I will read them but it probably won't sink in because no matter how tough things are in Wisconsin, i'm sure the Egyptians had more to complain about....

    Carry On.
    Last edited by Spim; 02-18-2011 at 02:16 PM. Reason: warm weather comment
    The problem with normal is that it just keeps getting worse...

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  2. #2
    PWCToday.com Is My Home Away From Home fox river pwc's Avatar
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    Re: WTF Wisconson , Protesting, this ain't Egypt !

    They're not even being asked to pay their fair share, they're being asked to pay a FRACTION of their fair share.

    The teacher's unions are the most amazing. Whenever they're in the mood to demand more pay or benefits, or both, they always play the guilt card and say, "but it's all about the children" or "but it's for the children" or "we need this money to insure quality educations for the children". Then, in this case, they turn around and pull these illegal sick-outs and shut down multiple school districts throughout the state - basically throwing the children under the bus, or loading them on busses to madison and telling them to protest along with them. Sickening...

    Don't even get me started on the correlation between spending increases on education in wisconsin, as test scores and graduation rates continue to plummet. Of course, if you ask the teacher's union, that's all cuz we STILL don't spend enough on education AND the parents all suck - so none of it's the teacher's fault anyhow. Now, if test scores or graduation rates were to spike upward from time to time, guess who is taking all the credit???

    Anyhow, Gov. Scott Walker is doing exactly what he was elected to do. Don't let the liberal, uniformed, and often purely false news coverage fool you. MSNBC hasn't even got the numbers close to right yet. Walker and the newly elected republican majority in the state senate have the support of the majority of the taxpayers right now - despite all the national obama/democrat money being spent to make it look otherwise. The only thing Walker has to worry about is not going far enough, but I believe this is just the start of budget fixes to come.

    Now I just want Walker to come up with a JOB-SWAP program. If you're a gov't employee, and you don't like the deal you're getting, then WI will find you a private sector employee in a similar position to SWAP jobs with. Simple. Ain't reality great ?
    Last edited by fox river pwc; 02-18-2011 at 02:36 PM.


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  3. #3
    PWCToday.com Is My Home Away From Home fox river pwc's Avatar
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    Re: WTF Wisconson , Protesting, this ain't Egypt !

    Oh yeah, I also got a kick out of one of the speakers at the protest basically ripping on Gov. Walker for "not even having a college education" - clearly implying that people without college educations are stupid, right? Can you imagine what the mainstream media would do if a conservative stepped up and implied that those w/o college degrees were stupid? The hypocrisy in WI is so deep right now it's amazing. The good thing is that more and more people are finally seeing it, and they're ready to make changes as a result of it...


    WHEN IN DOUBT, GAS IT!

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  4. #4
    Norge PWCToday.com Is My Home Away From Home R Hudson's Avatar
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    Re: WTF Wisconson , Protesting, this ain't Egypt !

    Ok you buggers.

    You drew me in on this one.

    First of all, I don't necessarily agree with the tactics on both sides of this one.

    Unions in general have become a bad thing and yes, there are many problems related to the teachers unions.

    Walker's approach to this is similar to trying to cure a headache by chopping off the head.

    If you know teachers (and I know and speak to MANY regularly) who work in this system it is often their only shred of hope that they will be able to make ends meet. They have to work hard and endure many years of contract work before they can even start to hopefully enjoy any scrap of security. Mind you, I am talking about the honest, hard-working ones and NOT the system-milkers, plenty of which are located mostly in the larger urban areas.

    Also, why are Police and Fire unions NOT affected? I haven't found a clear answer on that one yet other than the fact that they contributed to Walker's campaign. If this is not the case I apologize as I have not seen anything to the contrary yet.

    So, in general I AGREE with what Walker wants to accomplish because our state is in bad shape but I heartily DISAGREE with his approach to this.

    No doubt today's events (and more days to come I suspect) will prove interesting. If nothing else it has exposed the fact that this needs to be addressed and soon!

  5. #5
    PWCToday.com Is My Home Away From Home Spim's Avatar
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    Re: WTF Wisconson , Protesting, this ain't Egypt !

    who you calling a bugger.. bugger !
    and yes Imho the police/fire should be lumped in with all of them.
    We just had a local outrage by police being asked to pay $100 a month to take their cruiser home.
    $100 month, free transportation, insurance, no service costs, and gas to and from work... $100...
    Sign me up !!!
    So much will depend on the media's slant on this too, i'm actually looking forward to going home and turning on the news for a change !
    The problem with normal is that it just keeps getting worse...

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  6. #6
    PWCToday.com Is My Home Away From Home Maulin Marto's Avatar
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    Talking Re: WTF Wisconson , Protesting, this ain't Egypt !

    Quote Originally Posted by R Hudson View Post
    Ok you buggers.

    You drew me in on this one.

    First of all, I don't necessarily agree with the tactics on both sides of this one.

    Unions in general have become a bad thing and yes, there are many problems related to the teachers unions.

    Walker's approach to this is similar to trying to cure a headache by chopping off the head.

    If you know teachers (and I know and speak to MANY regularly) who work in this system it is often their only shred of hope that they will be able to make ends meet. They have to work hard and endure many years of contract work before they can even start to hopefully enjoy any scrap of security. Mind you, I am talking about the honest, hard-working ones and NOT the system-milkers, plenty of which are located mostly in the larger urban areas.

    Also, why are Police and Fire unions NOT affected? I haven't found a clear answer on that one yet other than the fact that they contributed to Walker's campaign. If this is not the case I apologize as I have not seen anything to the contrary yet.

    So, in general I AGREE with what Walker wants to accomplish because our state is in bad shape but I heartily DISAGREE with his approach to this.

    No doubt today's events (and more days to come I suspect) will prove interesting. If nothing else it has exposed the fact that this needs to be addressed and soon!
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  7. #7
    PWCToday.com Is My Home Away From Home fox river pwc's Avatar
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    Re: WTF Wisconson , Protesting, this ain't Egypt !

    Police and Fire are next.

    This is just the beginning.

    Going after all the solutions at once would have been too much at once, as evidenced by the amount and type of current reaction.

    Chopping off the head? Hardly. Do the math, based on the facts of what they're being asked to pay - and also factor in that the furlough days will now go away and no one gets laid off, and this current proposal is hardly extreme - certainly not extreme compared to what private-sector workers have been enduring recently.

    For the record, I appreciate teachers, and I know tons of them have been roped into this mess against their will. I feel bad for them. Maybe one of them would be willing to trade jobs with me ? Somehow I doubt you'd find even one that would.
    Last edited by fox river pwc; 02-18-2011 at 03:04 PM.


    WHEN IN DOUBT, GAS IT!

    Yeah, I'm an @sshole, but I'm not a complete @sshole.

    http://badgerlandjetpilots.com/

    I don't come here to make enemies - only to identify them...

  8. #8
    PWCToday.com Is My Home Away From Home Spim's Avatar
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    Re: WTF Wisconson , Protesting, this ain't Egypt !

    <<< 7 Teachers in my Family...
    They do pretty dam well, best benefits/pension around.

    I'm just sick of the "where's my free sh1t" attitude !
    The problem with normal is that it just keeps getting worse...

    I would rather sit than quit...
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  9. #9
    PWCToday.com Is My Home Away From Home Maulin Marto's Avatar
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    Re: WTF Wisconson , Protesting, this ain't Egypt !

    Quote Originally Posted by Spim View Post
    <<< 7 Teachers in my Family...
    They do pretty dam well, best benefits/pension around.

    I'm just sick of the "where's my free sh1t" attitude !
    Teachers should be paid millions....big fat azz sports athletes...a current teachers salary.
    2010 UWP Masters National Champion, Governor's Cup / 2013 GLWC Masters #1/2013 GLWC Ski Slalom #1/2013 Vet Open #2
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  10. #10
    Norge PWCToday.com Is My Home Away From Home R Hudson's Avatar
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    Re: WTF Wisconson , Protesting, this ain't Egypt !

    Quote Originally Posted by fox river pwc View Post
    Police and Fire are next.

    This is just the beginning.

    Going after all the solutions at once would have been too much at once, as evidenced by the amount and type of current reaction.

    Chopping off the head? Hardly. Do the math, based on the facts of what they're being asked to pay - and also factor in that the furlough days will now go away and no one gets laid off, and this current proposal is hardly extreme - certainly not extreme compared to what private-sector workers have been enduring recently.

    For the record, I appreciate teachers, and I know tons of them have been roped into this mess against their will. I feel bad for them. Maybe one of them would be willing to trade jobs with me ? Somehow I doubt you'd find even one that would.
    They are not being "asked" to pay they are being told to pay.

    Think of it this way. There is a pension plan. Since there is a pension plan THAT is the retirement plan for many teachers. The tradeoff for having a good pension/benefits is more often than not.....lower pay. Most teaching careers are planned around this and it was their plan. Now, I am speaking in generalities here and realize that the unions themselves are often a huge problem.

    The problem with Walker's approach is that he just decided. He didn't consult, have talks with, do research (other than straight numbers), etc. He just DID. That's where the problem lies.

    I think a lot of us agree that something needs to be done but often HOW it is done is as important (long term) as WHAT is done.

    Once again, I am NOT a fan of unions in general, so I don't want to give that impression.

    Personally, if I was told that by accepting this I would get to keep my job I would accept and be happy that I was employed vs. unemployed, especially in tough times like these.
    Last edited by R Hudson; 02-18-2011 at 03:54 PM.

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