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  1. #21
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    PWCToday.com Is My Home Away From Home
    NitroShark's Avatar
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    Re: Turbo Aquatrax ECU alternative thread

    Building an MS is not a mission to take on if you want a cheap system.

    If you want a cheap system, buy a used take off from someone else's failed project on e-bay.

    MS is made for people who want to flash their own boot loader into the processor and edit the code (not tune from the GUI) to make the system work with an application that requires very specific capabilities.


    Shawn
    Nitro R12x-F12x and F15x Stage 1 Fastest Kits available Stg 2-3. Big Turbos, Pistons, Ride plates, Intercoolers, injectors, Cams, Head work, Valve spring kits and more Info? email me at SgRacing8@gmail.com






  2. #22
    I dream skis
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    Re: Turbo Aquatrax ECU alternative thread

    Hey hes back. Nice to see ya again.
    '08 RXP

  3. #23
    PWCToday.com Is My Home Away From Home vitaly's Avatar
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    Re: Turbo Aquatrax ECU alternative thread

    Quote Originally Posted by NitroShark
    Building an MS is not a mission to take on if you want a cheap system.

    If you want a cheap system, buy a used take off from someone else's failed project on e-bay.

    MS is made for people who want to flash their own boot loader into the processor and edit the code (not tune from the GUI) to make the system work with an application that requires very specific capabilities.


    Shawn
    Has not the MS GUI front end been developed yet?

    BTW, welcome back Shawn!
    On the other hand, I might welcome myself as well... LOL
    Last edited by vitaly; 07-07-2007 at 12:54 AM.

  4. #24
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    Re: Turbo Aquatrax ECU alternative thread

    best of luck getting them to call you....you may want to research who owns Keihin
    Last edited by v6speed04; 07-07-2007 at 01:09 AM.
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    -R-12X
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  5. #25
    Top Dog west_coaster's Avatar
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    Re: Turbo Aquatrax ECU alternative thread

    Quote Originally Posted by NitroShark
    Building an MS is not a mission to take on if you want a cheap system.

    If you want a cheap system, buy a used take off from someone else's failed project on e-bay.

    MS is made for people who want to flash their own boot loader into the processor and edit the code (not tune from the GUI) to make the system work with an application that requires very specific capabilities.


    Shawn
    Hey, good to see you here.

    Respectfully, I've been using MS for over 5 years, I've flashed the embedded code twice only to take advantage of some new features. The tuning is done 100% from a windows based GUI called Megatune, not through editing code. I've seen the Autronics s/w as well as SDS, link, EMS and Wolf. MS is pretty good, and is really configurable. The graphical datalog (Windows GUI) is very similar to the autronics you have posted in the past. It's also interactive.


    Megatune.GIF
    MS2.GIF
    MS.GIF


    log.GIF
    Here's a snap of the datalog viewer


    EMS.GIF
    Here's some EMS I have on my laptop as a contrast for tuning a friends Subie EJ 2.5, MS is way easier IMHO.


    Let's not turn this into a competition, no bashing is wanted.
    Last edited by west_coaster; 07-07-2007 at 01:43 AM.
    05 F-12X

    I'm on the drinking diet. I lost 2 days already.

  6. #26
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    Re: Turbo Aquatrax ECU alternative thread

    Those screen shots of the GUI programming interface look pretty well developed.

    Thanks for sharing them. How would you rate the tech support, or is there any?

    Have you ever had a ECU failure during the time you've been using it?

    Just probing.
    2003 F-12 - Riva splash guard, Boarding step
    2003 R-12X - Macsboost #53 + Intercooler, Solas 17/29, Boarding step
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  7. #27
    Top Dog west_coaster's Avatar
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    Re: Turbo Aquatrax ECU alternative thread

    Quote Originally Posted by danketchpel
    Those screen shots of the GUI programming interface look pretty well developed.

    Thanks for sharing them. How would you rate the tech support, or is there any?

    Have you ever had a ECU failure during the time you've been using it?

    Just probing.
    As MS is an open project, there are tons of forums and experts willing to help you over issues (just like we have here, only extremely technical). Often the original designers will answer your questions.

    I've not had a single hiccup over the 5 years I've been using it, and I've done 4 other builds/installs which are also still going. Actually, I've probably done ~10 systems over the last 5 years with different ECU's, and have never even heard of an ECU going bad. These are all off-road cars that we've been beating as hard as we can.

    MS uses a Motorolla Automotive CPU. Hardware issues are usually caused by wiring errors during the initial system bring up.

    Many of the GUI tuning tools are interactive, meaning you can click on a cell while the engine is running and change a spark or fuel parameter. If you see your AFR going a bit lean, you can hit a key on your laptop realtime and add fuel.

    BTW, all those displays above are completely customizable, you can put whatever gauges on a display, then customize the gauge if you want. On mine, I added spark angle and a gauge for my LC-1 wideband. You can also add any measurable parameter you want to your datalogs. Make troubleshooting or tuning much easier when everything is there in front of you.
    Last edited by west_coaster; 07-08-2007 at 02:39 AM.
    05 F-12X

    I'm on the drinking diet. I lost 2 days already.

  8. #28
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    Re: Turbo Aquatrax ECU alternative thread

    Very cool!

    What would you see necessary to make it survive a marine environment? I'm talking about the new Microsquirt which maybe you haven't had a chance to get up close and personal with yet.

    While I'm fascinated by doing a project like this I'd never want to give up my "Honda reliability". That's one of the reasons I want to preserve as much of the stock Honda system as possible, especially the ignition components.

    I've got no problem with making harnesses etc., I've been doing high tech cables for industrial use for years.

    I'm quite good at tuning carburators but admit to having almost zero experience in "digital tuning" so I'd need to learn the fundementals of the components but I'm technically savvy so I don't see a problem there, just time.

    In your estimation (since you've done several systems), how long do you think it would take to get a workable program (map) sorted out? Something that might not be 100% spot on but at least 95%.
    2003 F-12 - Riva splash guard, Boarding step
    2003 R-12X - Macsboost #53 + Intercooler, Solas 17/29, Boarding step
    SoCal Watercraft Club member
    SoCal Club Website
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  9. #29
    Top Dog west_coaster's Avatar
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    Re: Turbo Aquatrax ECU alternative thread

    Quote Originally Posted by danketchpel
    Very cool!

    What would you see necessary to make it survive a marine environment? I'm talking about the new Microsquirt which maybe you haven't had a chance to get up close and personal with yet.

    While I'm fascinated by doing a project like this I'd never want to give up my "Honda reliability". That's one of the reasons I want to preserve as much of the stock Honda system as possible, especially the ignition components.

    I've got no problem with making harnesses etc., I've been doing high tech cables for industrial use for years.

    I'm quite good at tuning carburators but admit to having almost zero experience in "digital tuning" so I'd need to learn the fundementals of the components but I'm technically savvy so I don't see a problem there, just time.

    In your estimation (since you've done several systems), how long do you think it would take to get a workable program (map) sorted out? Something that might not be 100% spot on but at least 95%.
    Microsquirt is already marine ready, it's fully sealed and uses a weatherproof connector (Ampseal 35 pin). I've never used Microsquirt, but it uses the exact same tuning tools as Megasquirt, and even runs the same firmware. The main difference with Microsquirt, the board is very small and comes to you operational with the housing and all. The components are SMT and overall size is about the size of an Ipod.

    With Megasquirt, you have to assemble the board yourself (solder components, install firmware, do initial bringup). It takes a few nights to build up a Megasquirt, and if your not good with electronics and soldering, you'll most likely have a problem somewhere.

    The main difference is Megasquirt is a few hundred bucks cheaper, but then you need to waterproof it and there are a few other issues. Most likely we'll only concentrate on Microsquirt for now.

    Tuning is IMHO the toughest part. You can literally spend months tuning, it all depends where you want to call it good enough. I'm not sure you can get to 100%, there's always the potential for a bit better gas mileage by leaning a cell or sector, a degree more spark in some area, accelerator tuning, warm up, etc... I'd say we'll have a map that we can ride around on within a day at the bay. Probably a few more weekends to get the warmup and idle tuned, and then it will take a few more weekends to do fine tuning. So a couple months to get it to run better than stock, safely.
    05 F-12X

    I'm on the drinking diet. I lost 2 days already.

  10. #30

    Re: Turbo Aquatrax ECU alternative thread

    Ooh, Ooh.. was wondering the MegaSquirt-n-Spark Extra 2 manual and found note on a engine that has a cam sensor allot like ours.

    http://www.msextra.com/ms2extra/MS2-...tion.htm#miata

    Verry interesting. Looks like someone allready tried to put code in for our situation. Guess we'll see, I'll ping them about the status of this. If it's allready in there, it should be in the microsquirt as well.
    Robert Stellhorn #811 -- Retired from Racing for the moment
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    '89 Yamaha SuperJet Square Nose, ready to put the hurt on anyone, anytime
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